Interview with Chale Nafus

KR = Kyle Randolph, CN = Chale Nafus

KR: My first question is, in terms of AFS, on the website there's so many things you guys program - what's the process for programming each of these varied things, like Narratives-in-progress?

CN: We have a staff of around 10-12 full time people, and we all have overlapping duties - I'm the original programmer since 2002, I guess I'm like third or fourth in line, and a couple of years ago we brought in Lars Nilsen, who works at the Alamo Drafthouse, and he more than doubled our programming, and Holly Herrick, she programs a number of recent films that we can get. I do about 80, Lars does about 120, and our tastes are very complimentary, and we are interested in different types of films so we reach different audiences that way. What made that possible is having a theatre we can use 16 nights a month - until Lars and Holly came, we had to rent the Alamo Drafthouse for 2, 2.5 hour shifts - we could only do maybe 6-8 per month. So that's the film side of it, the educational part is done by Katy Daiger Dial, she handles all the education, all the school programs of about 15, 16 schools, they learn how to script and how to storyboard and she also handles our intensive, week-long summer classes, about 10-12 kids in each group.

KR: How about the narratives-in-progress, that seems like a cool program you guys do.

CN: There's two elements of in-progress screenings; there's doc-in-progress and narrative-in-progress, so anybody that wants to can submit a proposal to have their in-progress screened; they should be 85-90% finished with their film. Holly is in charge of in-progress screenings, and she has a team of I think three people to look over the proposals. Sometimes there will be several in one month, and other months there won't be any - we show about 10 per year.

KR: That's really cool, that's an awesome way to give people feedback they otherwise wouldn't get.

CN: Yeah, we've only had one person cry [laughs].

KR: That'd be rough [laughs]. So you said you have something like 10-12 full-time employees, right?

CN: Something like that, we've added a few people recently so I've started to lose track. We basically operate out of a 5x5 trailer that was previously occupied by an ABC Studios program called The Lying Game, I think they just did two seasons at our studios so when they did not renew the third season, we moved next door into those larger quarters and rent out our previous office space.

KR: So you have your own studios, you guys do a crazy amount of stuff!

CN: Yeah [laughs] I attribute this mostly, of course, to Richard Linklater, and while he doesn't have time to have hands-on oversight on the Society, he sets the spirit and the tone of the place. Back in 2001, when the airport in the middle of town was being vacated, Richard and Lewis Black, not the comedian, the editor of the Austin Chronicle, and a few other people went to the mayor of Austin and asked if they could have the hangers and proposed they could have a film production there, and so AFS rents it from the city for a small amount of money, a very minimal amount, and because so much is brought to Austin, the city has been very fortunate to have this studio.

KR: Bouncing off of that, just having done some research on the Society, you guys have a really amazing sense of community - how did you go about building such an in-tune community?

CN: It has evolved over time - one thing that started bringing people in was the film grants that we offer. So, that was a very good way to see who in TX was trying to make films - they submit around 200 or so every year. The University of Texas can't be discounted, so many Austin-based filmmakers came through UT, not Richard Linklater but some of the ones after him. So they were already working on each other's projects as students, and then many of them have maintained those relationships, so if you look at the credits of the Zellner brothers, people like that, you'll see names of other film makers - so then with the in-progress screenings, many of the people who come in are other Austin filmmakers, producers, editors, etc, so it's just a very compatible environment. I think Linklater set the tone because he's been very encouraging - I think even when he started the society, people came to see films, and talk about them afterwards. Austin was also just the right size - I don't know that it would work today, if they didn't all already know each other.

KR: Yeah, Austin's growing so fast.

CN: [laughs] That's right, some of the younger ones are into gaming and creating moving images for other media.

KR: Right right, like I know Rooster Teeth is a really big company down in Austin...

CN: Yeah, well they're in our previous office.

KR: Are they really?

CN: They're at the Film Society Studios.

KR: I had no idea! I've been following them for a really long time, I'm really into their company. I think I supported the Indiegogo for their film.

CN: That's great!

KR: Just talking about all this makes me really jealous of your community down there.

CN: [laughs] Well I went to graduate school in 66-68 in film, and if anyone ever told me "y'know, in 30, 35 years, Austin's going to be a film industry", I would have laughed in their face. I came back five years later in 73, if they'd said it to me then, I' would have still laughed at them. It was Linklater and eventually Robert Rodriguez basically staying here, based here, and then Mike Judge came, and then Terrince Mallick, so really big names came to stay, so it created something of a critical mass of people interested in film, whether they were going to make them or not, at least they would be around filmmakers.

KR: I'm all about that. So for the grants, you said something like 200 people apply?

CN: Just over 200, and we give something like 100,000 dollars to filmmakers overall. I think this year over 20 people got some money, individual grants are about 10-15k; they're often completion grants or music-rights grants, just very rarely is it to begin an entire film.

KR: That makes sense, it's to push the filmmakers along then. How do you decide who of the 200 people get the grants?

CN: So Holly and our senior interns or apprentices, a group of them will go through the initial 200 or so applications, then she chooses three judges from out-of-state - we don't want any interference with AFS or Austin people deciding who gets the money. I can't remember who came this year, but it's always three judges and they would be shipped 20, 25 applications and then they'd get together in Austin in August and hash it out.

KR: Cool, I also wanted to ask about the Texas Film Awards - how did it start and how has it grown since it's conception?

CN: Right, well it was started in 2001 so we'd already moved to the airports, we had a big hanger, people came in and decorated and put in a stage, and I know that year we honored Quentin Tarentino and Sissy Spacek, she was introduced by her cousin Rip Torn, but it was literally the kick-off for South by Southwest that year.

KR: Whoa, that's really awesome.

CN: Yes, it was because of Lewis Black, of course being on our board, the president at the time, and his associate with SXSW which was started by the Austin Chronicle - again, it's this idea of community. So we had the film awards the night before SXSW started.

KR: [geeks out]

CN: Back then, it was still really small - today we still have the awards the night before SXSW, but it's not as directly connected; people coming to South By, if they hear about us, they can come also. It's primarily a fund-raiser now; there was a period where it was generating 1/3 of our annual budget. We're much bigger now, so it doesn't cover as much for us -

KR: But for a while, it was just doing a crazy amount of work for you guys.

CN: Exactly, we continue with it and only once have we had it away from the studios - we went to the Austin City Limits theatre downtown one year, but we now have taken over the National Guard armory - [pause] without weapons, we - we didn't attack, it's right next door to our studio. So, that brought us two-more sound stages. They'll have to be fixed up, but that's where I think Rooster Teeth will be part of the time.

KR: That's so cool.

CN: Right now they're doing their film, they're using one of our sound stages.

KR: [more geeking out] My mind is being blown right now.

CN: Well come and visit, you'd have to fly, but it'd be nice to work there -

KR: [more geeking out about wanting to be at Rooster Teeth] Austin seems like an amazing place, I love the sense of community...

CN: Well, part of it is just coincidental - there was an attempt in the 70's to turn Austin into the 3rd coast due to Texas Chainsaw Massacre being filmed here, and then some low-budget films being shot here...anyway, well...I won't say anything about that [laughs] they were very cheap, easy movies, and then Raggedy Man was shot here, but that wasn't enough; there wasn't the structure or the talent needed here really.

KR: It had the films being made, but not the work-talent to keep it going. So you guys played a decent role in making Austin a bigger film community, it's incredible.

CN: Well a lot of our governors - I guess this is Rick Perry's one saving grace - really support film here in Austin, the governor before George Bush, she did a lot of work to bring film to Austin; she would go to Hollywood and she was such a talker and witty and intelligent, and so put her in the mix in the 90's along with AFS, and then the UT film department - mostly in doc, but they're just so supportive in so many ways. So you have the university, the government, and AFS, and having some major film makers here [to credit for the community], and we're already deep into our second generation of filmmakers.

KR: That's too cool, my next question would be... for those people who show films, what kind of stuff do you do to accommodate your filmmakers; like for Visions, we fly people in and give them hotel rooms and swag bags, do you guys have an equivalent to that?

CN: Well, we don't do Swag Bags, except during the Film Awards.

KR: That makes sense, it's an entirely different thing from Festivals anyway [laughs]

CN: Throughout the year, it's easier if a filmmaker is traveling with a film, and we can latch on to that. But we work with other organizations in town - there's Indie Meme, which brings in filmmakers from India about 2-3 times a year and we co-sponsor with them, and I've often been the MC-interviewer with that filmmaker. Also, the Austin Polish Film Festival, they always bring in 1-2 filmmakers from Poland and we co-sponsor with them; Austin Jewish Film Festival, same thing, of course they usually live-Skype their filmmakers. Cine las Americas, the Latino film festival, they bring in film makers from Latin America. Again, these are all groups that we co-sponsor with.

KR: That's cool though, it's working with all these different international film festivals then; I'm a huge fan of non-American film -

CN: Me, too.

KR: I've been taking classes on Japanese Cinema and Korean cinema and I love Asian cinema, so it's really amazing to have so many festivals in the area and that you guys co-sponsor with them. It's really amazing.

CN: It's really broadened our audience too, we have around 2000 members of the film society so they get discounts to all these other festivals. We do bring in various people; Holly does that more often, I do that with some of the doc filmmakers, I do a monthly doc presentation.

KR: That's amazing, so you've been working with these guys on the board since about '85, right?

CN: Right, I was on the board - I retired from teaching in 1998, and in 2002, the position for Director of Programming became available, and I thought it would be fun to do for a year or two -

KR: [laughs] and here we are, 12 years later...

CN: [laughs] I know, I'm actually retiring - my job will be available next July, get your resume ready!

KR: I'll do that, I'll have it ready!

CN: Then you'd be right next door to Rooster Teeth.

KR: That'd be crazy. In terms of all of this, is there anything you know now that you wish you knew back then? Are there any huge challenges you've had to overcome?

CN: Goodness...it seems like it's grown...organically, but sometimes in big leaps. I think if we could have had our own theatre sooner, that would have been great - we all wanted it, but it wasn't economically possible. The theatre we're in right now is called the Marquee Theatre, it was a 70's three-screen theater, and it closed of course, as so many of those have, and this woman, Deb, she re-opened it up as an event center. Mostly for weddings, and pole-dancing contests and burlesque shows [laughs], etc, but very smartly, she kept one room as a theatre. It's a 280 seat theatre, a bit big, but sometimes we fill all the seats. So Holly and Lars realized that could become a theatre, and we raised 120,000 dollars to put in digital projection and to upgrade the sound, we have Richard Linklater's polish film posters and hollywood posters. If we could have done that 10 years ago, and had been showing 200 film since then, it would have been great.

KR: But hey, you've got it now!

CN: Part of the plans for the National Guard Armory will be to build a theatre with one, two, or even three screens in varying size rooms.

KR: That's really great. Final question would be, is there anything I haven't asked you about AFS that you'd want to share or any kind of advice you could give to us?

CN: I think it just goes back to community - and you can't make community. You can set the foundation for it, set the opportunities for filmmakers to meet and exchange ideas, and emphasize things like good scripts and good writing. I've never had the courage to make a film - so any advice I'd give as questionable value -

KR: [laughs] You have more experience than I do, I'd be down to hear any kind of advice you can pass along.

CN: My terrible advice is to sell drugs or sell your body, but that can't be said to young people. [laughs]

KR: [laughs] I'm taking incredible notes here, "sell drugs, sell yo' body".

CN: One or the other, not both.

KR: You can't double-dip? Okay, I'll keep that in mind. Very important note.

CN: The reason I say that is that one of my favorite German directors, Fassbender, it may have been his own legend he created...but he said he financed his first few films by stealing cars in Germany and taking them to Turkey, and selling them.

KR: Oh my god.

CN: Indiegogo is a better alternative. Maybe.

KR: But Indiegogo takes some of your profits, you keep all the profits from stealing cars!

CN: Yeah that's true! I think maybe the common idea in all of this is that you've got to be passionate about it - you've really got to want to MAKE a film, when I was teaching film history, I had students who wanted to be a filmmaker, I said "no, you have to want to make film". That image of being a director all that glamour...but the hard part is making the film! So I'd emphasize the verb "make", not "be".

KR: See, look at this useful advice! A little bit better than selling your body or drugs. But that's also very good advice. Thanks for taking the time to do this interview with me! I'm definitely trying to go to Austin after I graduate -

CN: Well if you ever drop by, send me an email and let me know.